From LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU Sat Oct 16 09:04:43 1999 Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 10:59:10 -0500 From: "L-Soft list server at University of Illinois at Chicago (1.8c)" To: Laura Quilter Subject: File: "FEMINISTSF LOG9909E" ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 18:59:34 -0400 Reply-To: asaro@sff.net Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: Catherine Asaro Subject: Comments on Ascendant Sun cover (X Post) Comments: To: FEMINISTSF-LIT@listserv.uic.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I would be interested in comments you all have on the cover for =Ascendant Sun.= Tor chose the same artist for this book as they did for my last book, The Radiant Seas, that we talked about last year. I had liked =The Radiant Seas= cover because it showed a woman in such a strong position, active, dressed in realistic clothes (no chain bikinis here ), and in a position of strength, leaping out the center of the cover. In this one, the artist (Julie Bell) did some coolly provocative things with role reversal. Normally in art, both old and new, the focus of a picture is the male character, even if he's not present. By that, I mean that the picture is presented with the male's view in mind. So women are shown looking off into space or in sexualized poses. When men appear, they tend to dominate the picture, or else they stare straight out of the picture at the viewer. Julie turned that all upside down in this picture. It leaves no doubt that the woman controls the situation and the man is the figure of beauty. This cover has startled people and created some controversy. I would be interested to know what you all think. I'm also interested what the guys here about it. Would you be put off by such a cover? Half my readers are men, so I'm wondering if they will pick up this book. Not that I'm saying Tor should play it safer on future books; I think it's cool that they are willing to take chances. But I do wonder how male readers will respond to the art. A message board for posting comments has been set up for responses, or you can reply to me in email if you prefer. Also, I really do plan to put up the responses folks sent for me to post about =The Radiant Seas= cover, which I promised to do last year! Thanks for you input. -- Best regards Catherine Asaro http://www.sff.net/people/asaro/ ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 19:45:43 -0500 Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: Chris Shaffer Subject: Re: Comments on Ascendant Sun cover (X Post) In-Reply-To: <37F299BB.6C3C@sff.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed I really like the Radiant Seas cover but am nowhere near as impressed with Ascendant Sun. I couldn't possibly see the young man as a sex object. While I agree that the positioning of the characters breaks traditional roles in these settings, it seems a bit on the cheesy side to me. ----- Books are for use. Every reader his book. Every book its reader. Save the time of the reader. A library is a growing organism. Chris Shaffer http://www.uic.edu/~shaffer/ shaffer@uic.edu AIM:ChrisShaff ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 22:03:36 -0400 Reply-To: asaro@sff.net Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: Catherine Asaro Subject: Well, I'm a dolt Comments: To: FEMINISTSF-LIT@listserv.uic.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In my last post about the cover for my book, =Ascendant Sun,= I forgot to put the web address for the cover (duh ). To find the cover, go to: http://www.sff.net/people/asaro/ and click on the link that say ASCENDANT SUN cover. Thanks! -- Best regards Catherine Asaro http://www.sff.net/people/asaro/ ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 06:48:44 PDT Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: Daniel Krashin Subject: Re: Comments on Ascendant Sun cover (X Post) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed >Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 18:59:34 -0400 >From: Catherine Asaro >Subject: Comments on Ascendant Sun cover (X Post) > >I would be interested in comments you all have on the cover for >=Ascendant Sun.= Tor chose the same artist for this book as they did >for my last book, The Radiant Seas, that we talked about last year. I >liked that cover, too. >In this one, the artist (Julie Bell) did some coolly provocative >things >with role reversal. Normally in art, both old and new, the focus of a >picture is the male character, even if he's not present. By that, I mean >that the picture is presented with the male's view in mind. So women are >shown looking off into space or in sexualized poses. When men appear, >they tend to dominate the picture, or else they stare straight out of the >picture at the viewer. Julie turned that all upside down in this picture. >It leaves no doubt that the woman controls the situation and the man is the >figure of beauty. Yeah, he is a magnificent specimen... wonder how many books you have to sell to get FABIO?!? Umm, to be blunt: this cover seems like a very specific twist on old book cover cliches: this scene is very obviously the cover of a romance novel, but with the roles switched (the hunk is the one with the dazed look, and the woman looks tough and dominant), and the trappings have a SF/fantasy feeling to them. In other words, this cover says to me, "fem-dominant romance novel set in a SF/fantasy setting". It doesn't even look like the cover of a SF/Fantasy novel, mind you -- it could be one of the funky genre-bending romances you see lately. I would hazard a guess that this book cover will appeal powerfully to a core SF/romance audience, but sharply limit your breakthrough potential. That may or may not be good, depending on the size of that core. >This cover has startled people and created some controversy. I would be >interested to know what you all think. I'm also interested what guys here >about it. Would you be put off by such a cover? Half my >the readers are men, so I'm wondering if they will pick up this book. I wouldn't, not unless I were already a fan. I don't care for romances. I might buy it for my wife, who likes SF and romances and likes Bujold a lot. All this is strictly IMO, of course, but I have been reading SF&F voraciously for about 23 years and I think I know a bit about how the genre works. Please also note that all this has nothing to do with what is actually in the book. I just think you're being typecast. Danny ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 14:20:48 -0500 Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: Todd Mason Subject: Gunter Grass picks up Nobel MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sometimes surrealist writer Gunter Grass, best known in the US for THE TIN DRUM, is the 1999 Nobel Laureate for Literature, in the odd chance you haven't heard elsewhere... ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 18:02:09 EDT Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: Stephanie Dumoski Subject: Marion Zimmer Bradley MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit For those of you who have not heard, Marion Zimmer Bradley died last weekend. There is board for those who wish to share rememberances at www.phantastes.com/forums.html