Subject: File: "FEMINISTSF LOG0202C" ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 23:56:58 +1100 Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: Maire Subject: Re: 50 F&SF Works that Socialists Should Read Comments: To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit is this the same list that China Meiville compiled? Maire Hard SF- Feb BOTM "A Fire Upon the Deep" by Vernor Vinge http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hardsf Original Fantasy- Feb BOTM "Perdido St Station" by China Meiville http://groups.yahoo.com/group/original_fantasy Soft SF- Feb BOTM "A Case of Conscience" by James Blish http://groups.yahoo.com/group/soft_sf > -----Original Message----- > From: For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature > [mailto:feministsf@UIC.EDU]On Behalf Of Todd Mason > Sent: Wednesday, 13 February 2002 9:42 AM > To: feministsf@UIC.EDU > Subject: [*FSFFU*] 50 F&SF Works that Socialists Should Read > > > Here's the link: > http://www.sfsite.com/fm/show.html?rw,50socialist,1 > > (sorry for redundancy, if any, and thanks to Marty Halpern for > pointing this > out. TM...who might further recommend Charles Platt's FREE ZONE) > > -------------------------------------------------- > This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for > discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To > unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to > LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: > unsubscribe feministsf > > Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. -------------------------------------------------- This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: unsubscribe feministsf Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2002 11:39:43 -0800 Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: Todd Mason Subject: Re: 50 F&SF Works that Socialists Should Read Comments: To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit It is, indeed, China Meiville's list. And his annotations. If he's posted it elsewhere, I'm not yet aware of it. Maire wrote: > is this the same list that China Meiville compiled? ---------------------------------------------------- Sign Up for NetZero Platinum Today Only $9.95 per month! http://my.netzero.net/s/signup?r=platinum&refcd=PT97 -------------------------------------------------- This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: unsubscribe feministsf Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 18:15:31 +0000 Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: Angela Barclay Subject: what is an ansible? Comments: To: feministsf@uic.edu Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Dear listmembers: A couple of months ago I asked for your help identifying SF objects, ideas and events which have become reality. You provided a fascinating list which includes the two moons of Mars (Jonathan Swift), the satellite (Arthur C. Clarke), the cell phone (Robert Heinlein) and the Internet (Vernor Vinge). I would like to be able to include (in a paragraph in my paper) a female-created reality- Ursula Le Guin's ansible- but am not clear enough as to what this device is/does. Can anyone help me out? I did go to http://66.108.177.107/SF/sf_citations.shtml which is the Oxford English Dictionary SF citations site and discovered the following annotation, but would like to know more: >ansible (n.) antedating 1966 (LeGuin, Rocannon's Worldl) > >Mike Christie submitted a cite from LeGuin, Rocannon's World (1966). >(Earliest cite in the OED: 1974) thanks, angela -------------------------------------------------- This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: unsubscribe feministsf Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 19:55:21 -0600 Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: "Michael J. Lowrey" Organization: The Working Class Subject: Re: what is an ansible? Comments: To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Angela Barclay wrote: > > Dear listmembers: > > A couple of months ago I asked for your help identifying SF objects, ideas > and events which have become reality. You provided a fascinating list which > includes the two moons of Mars (Jonathan Swift), the satellite (Arthur C. > Clarke), the cell phone (Robert Heinlein) and the Internet (Vernor Vinge). > I would like to be able to include (in a paragraph in my paper) a > female-created reality- Ursula Le Guin's ansible- but am not clear enough as > to what this device is/does. Can anyone help me out? > > I did go to http://66.108.177.107/SF/sf_citations.shtml which is the Oxford > English Dictionary SF citations site and discovered the following > annotation, but would like to know more: > > >ansible (n.) antedating 1966 (LeGuin, Rocannon's Worldl) > > > >Mike Christie submitted a cite from LeGuin, Rocannon's World (1966). > >(Earliest cite in the OED: 1974) The technical definition of an ansible is: a communication device which violates relativity by allowing instantaneous communication across vast distances, in violation of physics as we understand it. In LeGuin's books, one end is mobile, and the other end must be firmly rooted within a gravity well, in order for an ansible connection to function. Section 5 of this site lists various other ansible-style communications in SF, but uses 'ansible' as the accepted term for such things. -- Michael J. "Orange Mike" Lowrey Sunrise Book Reviews -------------------------------------------------- This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: unsubscribe feministsf Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 20:01:06 -0600 Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: "Michael J. Lowrey" Organization: The Working Class Subject: Re: what is an ansible? Comments: To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit "Michael J. Lowrey" wrote: > The technical definition of an ansible is: a communication > device which violates relativity by allowing instantaneous > communication across vast distances, in violation of physics > as we understand it. In LeGuin's books, one end is mobile, > and the other end must be firmly rooted within a gravity > well, in order for an ansible connection to function. > > Section 5 of this site lists various other ansible-style > communications in SF, but uses 'ansible' as the accepted > term for such things. Ooops! Omitted the URL; "this list" is: http://www.kentaurus.com/drives.txt -------------------------------------------------- This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: unsubscribe feministsf Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 11:19:40 +1100 Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: Maire Subject: Re: what is an ansible? Comments: To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" In-Reply-To: <3C705F09.A2A4A887@uwm.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ansible is not really a female created reality though? Given that, it is impossible as we understand physics, FTL is pretty much considered fantasy at this stage, even for future, thoguh of course that may change. The Forever War by Joe Haldeman- ansible is used in it, with a mention of le Guin as creating the term (not by name though, IIRC) Maire Hard SF- Feb BOTM "A Fire Upon the Deep" by Vernor Vinge http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hardsf Original Fantasy- Feb BOTM "Perdido St Station" by China Meiville http://groups.yahoo.com/group/original_fantasy Soft SF- Feb BOTM "A Case of Conscience" by James Blish http://groups.yahoo.com/group/soft_sf > -----Original Message----- > From: For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature > [mailto:feministsf@UIC.EDU]On Behalf Of Michael J. Lowrey > Sent: Monday, 18 February 2002 12:55 PM > To: feministsf@UIC.EDU > Subject: Re: [*FSFFU*] what is an ansible? > > > Angela Barclay wrote: > > > > Dear listmembers: > > > > A couple of months ago I asked for your help identifying SF > objects, ideas > > and events which have become reality. You provided a > fascinating list which > > includes the two moons of Mars (Jonathan Swift), the satellite > (Arthur C. > > Clarke), the cell phone (Robert Heinlein) and the Internet > (Vernor Vinge). > > I would like to be able to include (in a paragraph in my paper) a > > female-created reality- Ursula Le Guin's ansible- but am not > clear enough as > > to what this device is/does. Can anyone help me out? > > > > I did go to http://66.108.177.107/SF/sf_citations.shtml which > is the Oxford > > English Dictionary SF citations site and discovered the following > > annotation, but would like to know more: > > > > >ansible (n.) antedating 1966 (LeGuin, Rocannon's Worldl) > > > > > >Mike Christie submitted a cite from LeGuin, Rocannon's World (1966). > > >(Earliest cite in the OED: 1974) > > The technical definition of an ansible is: a communication > device which violates relativity by allowing instantaneous > communication across vast distances, in violation of physics > as we understand it. In LeGuin's books, one end is mobile, > and the other end must be firmly rooted within a gravity > well, in order for an ansible connection to function. > > Section 5 of this site lists various other ansible-style > communications in SF, but uses 'ansible' as the accepted > term for such things. > > -- > Michael J. "Orange Mike" Lowrey > Sunrise Book Reviews > > -------------------------------------------------- > This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for > discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To > unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to > LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: > unsubscribe feministsf > > Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. -------------------------------------------------- This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: unsubscribe feministsf Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 22:38:13 -0800 Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: Lee Anne Phillips Subject: Re: what is an ansible? Comments: To: Feminist SF , feministsf@UIC.EDU In-Reply-To: <20020218010650.DSGN26574.priv-edtnes12-hme0.telusplanet.ne t@[161.184.49.43]> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 06:15 PM 2/17/02 +0000, Angela Barclay wrote: >Dear listmembers: > >A couple of months ago I asked for your help identifying SF objects, ideas >and events which have become reality. You provided a fascinating list which >includes the two moons of Mars (Jonathan Swift), the satellite (Arthur C. >Clarke), the cell phone (Robert Heinlein) and the Internet (Vernor Vinge). >I would like to be able to include (in a paragraph in my paper) a >female-created reality- Ursula Le Guin's ansible- but am not clear enough as >to what this device is/does. Can anyone help me out? http://hem.passagen.se/peson42/lgw/e_basic.html Encyclopedia excerpts: Basic dictionary These are excerpts from the Hainish Encyclopedia. This is the basic dictionary with words and places that are not related to a specific book. Ansible The ansible is a device for instanteneous communication over the vast distances of space. It was invented by Shevek of Anarres. When there is massage to be sent between two ansibles, one of them has to be in a fixed position on a body of a sufficiently large mass, i.e. a planet. The other ansible may be on another planet, a ship or anywhere. A ship travelling in "NAFAL space" cannot transmit; it has to slow down and enter the normal space-time first. The principle is that information is immaterial and therefore it does not have to follow Einstein's statement that nothing can travel faster than light. The principle has been described by an analogy: if you have a very, very long rod, and you move one end of it from side to side, then the other end moves too. It takes a lot of energy to send messages over the ansible, and so it's very expensive. Due to cosmic mass interference, the range is limited to approx. 120 light years. -------------------------------------------------- This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: unsubscribe feministsf Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 00:10:33 -0800 Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: Lee Anne Phillips Subject: Re: what is an ansible? Comments: To: Feminist SF In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 11:19 AM 2/18/02 +1100, you wrote: >Ansible is not really a female created reality though? Given that, it is >impossible as we understand physics, FTL is pretty much considered fantasy >at this stage, even for future, thoguh of course that may change. Actually, there are several tantalizing hints that FTL *communication* *may* be possible, although we don't yet understand exactly how it might work, if at all. We should note that Einstein insisted that FTL communication and travel was impossible, but used it, among other things, to "prove" that quantum physics did not exist, a conceit which we would now consider "quaint" at best. While it seems unlikely, given our present state of knowledge, we don't know everything there is to know, and don't even know what sort of questions to ask about many bits of the universe that we may not have noticed or understood in any real sense. http://www.compu-web.com/ftl.htm http://www.npl.washington.edu/AV/altvw28.html http://www.npl.washington.edu/AV/altvw69.html http://www.npl.washington.edu/AV/altvw70.html http://www.npl.washington.edu/AV/altvw71.html While the rod analogy for the "ansible" breaks down quickly, since a rod such as that described cannot exist, and the real movement of any rod is dictated by the speed of sound within the material(s) that make up the rod, the possibility of FTL communication is not precluded by the failure of the analogy. We can easily note that when we strike a metal chime with a mallet, let's say a very long rod suspended in space, a pressure wave is built up within the chime that travels from one end of the chime to the other, is reflected in various ways, and will resonate like any vibrating object. A "rod" one hundred and fifty light years in length is, when one thinks about it, rather more like a wire than anything we would think of as a rod, even if it were as thick as the moon in cross section. If any device corresponding to the rod analogy could exist, we might expect harpists to have discovered FTL travel thousands of years ago. But I think Le Guin was looking for an analogy that would make a sort of "sense" to her readers, not describing real physics, so, in the sense that superluminal quantum effects have, in fact, been demonstrated, we could assert that the criteria for a female created reality have been at least partially met, although we don't, as yet, know exactly how this effect could be used to transmit information. Just as the Wizard of Oz could only ride as a passenger in his "airship," because he didn't know how it worked, we can only observe superluminal phenomena in the universe and wring our hands in frustration, since we don't know how to steer this unwieldy craft in any direction we might like to go. -------------------------------------------------- This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: unsubscribe feministsf Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 00:15:07 -0800 Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: Lee Anne Phillips Subject: Re: what is an ansible? Comments: To: Feminist SF , feministsf@UIC.EDU Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 06:15 PM 2/17/02 +0000, Angela Barclay wrote: >I would like to be able to include (in a paragraph in my paper) a >female-created reality- Ursula Le Guin's ansible- but am not clear enough as >to what this device is/does. Can anyone help me out? http://hem.passagen.se/peson42/lgw/e_basic.html Encyclopedia excerpts: Basic dictionary These are excerpts from the Hainish Encyclopedia. This is the basic dictionary with words and places that are not related to a specific book. Ansible The ansible is a device for instanteneous communication over the vast distances of space. It was invented by Shevek of Anarres. When there is massage to be sent between two ansibles, one of them has to be in a fixed position on a body of a sufficiently large mass, i.e. a planet. The other ansible may be on another planet, a ship or anywhere. A ship travelling in "NAFAL space" cannot transmit; it has to slow down and enter the normal space-time first. The principle is that information is immaterial and therefore it does not have to follow Einstein's statement that nothing can travel faster than light. The principle has been described by an analogy: if you have a very, very long rod, and you move one end of it from side to side, then the other end moves too. It takes a lot of energy to send messages over the ansible, and so it's very expensive. Due to cosmic mass interference, the range is limited to approx. 120 light years. -------------------------------------------------- This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: unsubscribe feministsf Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 00:17:00 -0800 Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: Lee Anne Phillips Subject: Re: what is an ansible? Comments: To: Feminist SF , feministsf@UIC.EDU Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed >In re: Ansibles http://hem.passagen.se/peson42/lgw/e_basic.html Encyclopedia excerpts: Basic dictionary These are excerpts from the Hainish Encyclopedia. This is the basic dictionary with words and places that are not related to a specific book. Ansible The ansible is a device for instanteneous communication over the vast distances of space. It was invented by Shevek of Anarres. When there is massage to be sent between two ansibles, one of them has to be in a fixed position on a body of a sufficiently large mass, i.e. a planet. The other ansible may be on another planet, a ship or anywhere. A ship travelling in "NAFAL space" cannot transmit; it has to slow down and enter the normal space-time first. The principle is that information is immaterial and therefore it does not have to follow Einstein's statement that nothing can travel faster than light. The principle has been described by an analogy: if you have a very, very long rod, and you move one end of it from side to side, then the other end moves too. It takes a lot of energy to send messages over the ansible, and so it's very expensive. Due to cosmic mass interference, the range is limited to approx. 120 light years. -------------------------------------------------- This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: unsubscribe feministsf Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 08:53:37 -0800 Reply-To: publicity@mystgalaxy.com Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: Maryelizabeth Hart Organization: Mysterious Galaxy Subject: "Bitch" magazine articles -- black women in SF Comments: To: Feminist SF/Fantasy and Utopia Literature ON TOPIC , IsaacL , Science Fiction and Fantasy Listserv MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit the current issue (#15) of "Bitch magazine has a long article about "Sci-Fi Sisters" by Elyce Rae Helford (focused mostly on film media) and a sidebar on Octavia Butler by Inga Muscio. Seemed like there was not much new information for regular sf readers, but the articles are pretty informative for folks less familiar with the genre. Maryelizabeth -- ******************************************************************* Mysterious Galaxy Books Local Phone: 858.268.4747 7051 Clairemont Mesa Blvd, Suite 302 Fax: 858.268.4775 San Diego, CA 92111 Long Distance/Orders: 1.800.811.4747 http://www.mystgalaxy.com General Email: mgbooks@mystgalaxy.com ******************************************************************* -------------------------------------------------- This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: unsubscribe feministsf Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 13:03:16 -0800 Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: Lee Anne Phillips Subject: Re: what is an ansible? Comments: To: feministsf@UIC.EDU In-Reply-To: <20020218193456.GTDD26574.priv-edtnes12-hme0.telusplanet.ne t@[161.184.46.194]> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed The question could easily be expanded, as one of the first "Science Fiction" stories written by a woman, Mary Shelley's Frankenstein, or The Modern Prometheus, foresaw the advent of organ and body part transplants, miraculous medical resuscitation protocols that have generated considerable controversy in their own right, and the social issues involved in human organ donation. Comparing, as she does by reference, the impact of these technologies to the knowledge of fire was an astonishing leap of inference. Although Frankenstein is often dismissed as a "mere" Gothic novel, the only real link to traditional Gothics was the fact that it was written by a woman, and "women write Gothics." In fact, the book ignores almost all the trappings of Gothicism, with no heroine to be endangered or rescued, and an action and plot almost exclusively focused on a male millieu, courage, morality, high-minded endeavor, intellectual curiosity, obsessive thrusting at the boundaries of safety and experience, and the like. Charlotte Perkins Gilman, in Herland and With Her in Ourland, imagined a Separatism not really tried until the 1970's, albeit without the lesbian feminist philosophical underpinnings, and with a healthy dose of cultural feminism thrown in as a replacement. And we mustn't forget Andre Norton, whose strong female protagonists were not noticeably present in the actual culture from which she wrote, although sexual equality was given lip service in the 60's; the reality was far different. But the Forerunner books posited a world in which sexual equality was a given, and women could *do* things without running to men for help. The Forerunner books were also written with an audience composed at least partially of women in mind, also a huge leap forward in conceptualization for the time she wrote in. Interestingly, they were set in an imagined past, not the "future," perhaps in unconscious echo of some prehistoric Amazonian archetype. Her early books were written "exclusively" for an audience of young males, and her legal name change (from Alice Mary Norton to Andre {"Alice"} Norton) reflected the male hostility toward female writers who dared to mess with "their" turf. C.L. Moore and "James Tiptree, Jr." were similar quasi-masquerades by early women who wrote science fiction. So Andre's books can easily be seen as foreshadowing real cultural developments which seem destined to come to pass eventually, if not strictly right here and right now. In 1972 Joanna Russ wrote a ground-breaking short story, "When it Changed," later expanded into an oeuvre, surely informed by Lesbian Separatism but also foretelling it, that was so evocative that we find Adrienne Rich pulling Whileaway back into the world we live in a mere half decade later: Could you imagine a world of women only, The interviewer asked. Can you imagine a world where women are absent. (He believed He was joking.) Yet I have to imagine At one and the same moment, both. Because I live in both. Can you imagine, The interviewer asked, a world of men? (He thought he was joking.) If so, then, a world where men are absent? Absently, wearily, I answered: Yes. - Adrienne Rich, Natural Resources (1977) And there are a raft of women who began focusing on "women's issues" before they were at all popular elsewhere, the folly of rampant ecological exploitation and destruction (Sherri S. Tepper, Family Tree, 1998), the meaningless cruelty and slaughter of male power and dominance games (Judith Merrill, Shadow on the Hearth, 1950), homophobia (Ursula Le Guin, The Left Hand of Darkness, 1969), and sexism itself (too many to count, much less mention). In all of these, the alienation and powerlessness felt by many women, and the reality still for most of the world's women, despite smug "post-feminist" pretensions of some young people with little sense of history or global perspective, is placed into the future to see what comes of it and the prospect is usually dismal. Whether that alienation is a separation from our roots in the natural world, from each other, from social or economic classes, it inevitably leads to disaster before, hopefully, groping forward into recovery or healing. Would it be too much to imagine that the futures foretold by two generations of women writers may yet come to pass, to our hazard and peril? Just picking up the paper may tell one that we are quite possibly closer to Judith Merrill's Shadow on the Hearth right this very minute than at any time since Kennedy's Bay of Pigs macho posturing. Where's Whileaway when you really need it, anyway? -------------------------------------------------- This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: unsubscribe feministsf Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2002 01:05:16 -0600 Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: "Laura J. Mixon" Subject: Re: what is an ansible? Comments: To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020217224631.00a2c240@www.leeanne.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit on 2/18/02 2:10 AM, Lee Anne Phillips at leeanne@LEEANNE.COM wrote: > At 11:19 AM 2/18/02 +1100, you wrote: >> Ansible is not really a female created reality though? Given that, it is >> impossible as we understand physics, FTL is pretty much considered fantasy >> at this stage, even for future, thoguh of course that may change. > > Actually, there are several tantalizing hints that FTL *communication* > *may* be possible, although we don't yet understand exactly how it > might work, if at all. We should note that Einstein insisted that FTL > communication and travel was impossible, but used it, among other > things, to "prove" that quantum physics did not exist, a conceit which > we would now consider "quaint" at best. While it seems unlikely, > given our present state of knowledge, we don't know everything > there is to know, and don't even know what sort of questions to ask > about many bits of the universe that we may not have noticed or > understood in any real sense. Actually, to be technically correct, Einstein's general theory of relativity says that you can't accelerate an object with mass to the speed of light. This is where Niven (or was it Clarke?) got his "inertial-less drive" idea -- the idea was you instantly jump to that new velocity, without accelerating to it... > http://www.compu-web.com/ftl.htm > http://www.npl.washington.edu/AV/altvw28.html > http://www.npl.washington.edu/AV/altvw69.html > http://www.npl.washington.edu/AV/altvw70.html > http://www.npl.washington.edu/AV/altvw71.html > > While the rod analogy for the "ansible" breaks down quickly, since > a rod such as that described cannot exist, and the real movement > of any rod is dictated by the speed of sound within the material(s) > that make up the rod, the possibility of FTL communication is not > precluded by the failure of the analogy. We can easily note that > when we strike a metal chime with a mallet, let's say a very long rod > suspended in space, a pressure wave is built up within the chime > that travels from one end of the chime to the other, is reflected in > various ways, and will resonate like any vibrating object. A "rod" > one hundred and fifty light years in length is, when one thinks > about it, rather more like a wire than anything we would think of > as a rod, even if it were as thick as the moon in cross section. > > If any device corresponding to the rod analogy could exist, we might > expect harpists to have discovered FTL travel thousands of years ago. > But I think Le Guin was looking for an analogy that would make a sort > of "sense" to her readers, not describing real physics, so, in the sense > that superluminal quantum effects have, in fact, been demonstrated, > we could assert that the criteria for a female created reality have been > at least partially met, although we don't, as yet, know exactly how > this effect could be used to transmit information. Just as the Wizard of > Oz could only ride as a passenger in his "airship," because he didn't > know how it worked, we can only observe superluminal phenomena > in the universe and wring our hands in frustration, since we don't know > how to steer this unwieldy craft in any direction we might like to go. > > -------------------------------------------------- > This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for > discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To > unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to > LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: > unsubscribe feministsf > > Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. -------------------------------------------------- This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: unsubscribe feministsf Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2002 07:46:09 -0600 Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: "Michael J. Lowrey" Organization: The Working Class Subject: Re: what is an ansible? Comments: To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit "Laura J. Mixon" wrote: > > on 2/18/02 2:10 AM, Lee Anne Phillips at leeanne@LEEANNE.COM wrote: > > Actually, there are several tantalizing hints that FTL *communication* > > *may* be possible, although we don't yet understand exactly how it > > might work, if at all. We should note that Einstein insisted that FTL > > communication and travel was impossible, but used it, among other > > things, to "prove" that quantum physics did not exist, a conceit which > > we would now consider "quaint" at best. While it seems unlikely, > > given our present state of knowledge, we don't know everything > > there is to know, and don't even know what sort of questions to ask > > about many bits of the universe that we may not have noticed or > > understood in any real sense. > > Actually, to be technically correct, Einstein's general theory of relativity > says that you can't accelerate an object with mass to the speed of light. > This is where Niven (or was it Clarke?) got his "inertial-less drive" idea > -- the idea was you instantly jump to that new velocity, without > accelerating to it... It wasn't either of those young whippersnappers; the inertialess drive is to be found in the works of the Chronicler of Civilization, E.E. "Doc" Smith, Ph.D.! Don't they teach anything about classic literature in the schools these days... [grumble, mutter] -- Michael J. Lowrey orangelensman@clearether.com -------------------------------------------------- This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: unsubscribe feministsf Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2002 11:39:05 EST Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: Joy Martin Subject: Re: what is an ansible? Comments: To: feministsf@uic.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 2/18/02 3:48:28 PM Central Standard Time, leeanne@LEEANNE.COM writes: << Where's Whileaway when you really need it, anyway? >> Of course the Female Man is a great classic. And to put it in Whileaway reality, if I remember it correctly, it's really right next door. Thanks for the post- I have to take a little more time later to read it with more attention.-Joy Martin -------------------------------------------------- This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: unsubscribe feministsf Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2002 10:43:40 -0800 Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: Lee Anne Phillips Subject: Re: what is an ansible? Comments: To: Feminist SF In-Reply-To: <55.22c2af67.29a3d9a9@cs.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 11:39 AM 2/19/02 -0500, Joy Martin wrote: >In a message dated 2/18/02 3:48:28 PM Central Standard Time, >leeanne@LEEANNE.COM writes: > ><< Where's Whileaway when you really need it, anyway? >> >Of course the Female Man is a great classic. And to put it in Whileaway >reality, if I remember it correctly, it's really right next door. Thanks for >the post- I have to take a little more time later to read it with more >attention.-Joy Martin Interestingly, Russ explicitly rejects the "male" fantasy of independence and complete autonomy. In one of her Whileaway stories, she takes the viewpoint of a "policewoman" sent to execute a woman who has rejected her social responsibilities and wants to be a hermit, accountable to no one but herself. This is typical of her social vision; she unflinchingly shows what would really be necessary to sustain a "utopia" like Whileaway. Unlike the rather naive (if often charming) Daughters of a Coral Dawn, where the society moves of its own accord toward a sort of fascist cult of the personality, and willingly surrenders itself to the autocratic authority of one woman, but with no messy and unpleasant coercion anywhere to be seen, Whileaway deals with its problems in an adult, if sometimes disconcertingly ruthless way. Russ' heroines are similarly ruthless in other stories, and face reality with a clear eye, informed by an unsentimental assessment of the entirety of both technological advances and social situations. She was the first to point out (Picnic on Paradise) that time travel has horrifying implications. If time travel is possible, then the fact that we *remember* horrifying acts of genocide, widespread disasters, and even random acts of violence and injustice says something terrible about the people who control that technology and makes them complicit in every brutal act and murder. And if complicit, then perhaps co-conspirators, or even willing accomplices. And in We Who Are About To..., she again subverts the typical "impossibly life-threatening peril" so often used as a vehicle for portraying the (male) hero's astounding prowess and indomitable courage by having him discover a miraculous escape strategy, by making her dark heroine an agent of death and the only "escape" that of oblivion. As an aside, and in reference to the subject line of this thread, I just read Dave Langford's essay in which he discovers that "ansible" is an anagram of "lesbian." Well, what a surprise! What a droll wit we discover in Ursula after all these years and what an unexpected answer to the question. :-) -------------------------------------------------- This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: unsubscribe feministsf Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2002 14:07:51 EST Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: Joy Martin Subject: Re: what is an ansible? Comments: To: feministsf@uic.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 2/19/02 12:55:08 PM Central Standard Time, leeanne@LEEANNE.COM writes: << This is typical of her social vision; she unflinchingly shows what would really be necessary to sustain a "utopia" like Whileaway. >> Yes, she is an unflinching realist about a lot of things. Her characters argue the points quite interestingly. Of course, even so, they are not necessarily right. But...they are n't sugar coating anything. I think I've read all her works. I wish there were more. I read something interesting once, where,by whom or the exact contents I don't remember very well, about how by getting so far out ahead of the pack, she (and presumably some other writers) may have a difficult time developing their writing further. It's the problem of envisioning, esp. when you are so fiercely realistic in some ways, especially given the problems you (she) is interested in in her writing.-Joy Martin -------------------------------------------------- This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: unsubscribe feministsf Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2002 01:16:53 -0800 Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: Todd Mason Subject: Re: what is necessary for Utopia?: Martin and Phillips Comments: To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Interesting take on the development of Whileawayan society...I've always took Russ's hard-edged realism as expressed in the rationalization of Janet and her societal peers that such murderous oppression is necessary, as opposed to convenient to Whileaway's status quo...that Russ was too honest to make a true Utopia of Whileaway. One might gather that in a Utopia, there would be no romantic age taboos, and no reason for them, as opposed to the ones very much in force in both Joanna's and Janet's realities. Joy, if you haven't yet read Russ's MAGIC MOMMAS, TREMBLING SISTERS, PURITANS AND PERVERTS, dig and delve! This slim volume of essays is more challenging, perhaps, than even TO WRITE LIKE A WOMAN or WHAT ARE WE FIGHTING FOR?, which I fear may be her last (new) book...and more for physical reasons, perhaps, than for artistic ones. Or even commercial ones, though they, too, haven't had an insignificant role, despite the excellent and continuing sales of THE FEMALE MAN. TM Joy Martin wrote: > In a message dated 2/19/02 12:55:08 PM Central Standard Time, > leeanne@LEEANNE.COM writes: > > << This is typical of her social vision; she unflinchingly > shows what would really be necessary to sustain a "utopia" like Whileaway. > >> > Yes, she is an unflinching realist about a lot of things. Her characters > argue the points quite interestingly. Of course, even so, they are not > necessarily right. But...they are n't sugar coating anything. > > I think I've read all her works. I wish there were more. I read something > interesting once, where,by whom or the exact contents I don't remember very > well, about how by getting so far out ahead of the pack, she (and presumably > some other writers) may have a difficult time developing their writing > further. It's the problem of envisioning, esp. when you are so fiercely > realistic in some ways, especially given the problems you (she) is interested > in in her writing.-Joy Martin ---------------------------------------------------- Sign Up for NetZero Platinum Today Only $9.95 per month! http://my.netzero.net/s/signup?r=platinum&refcd=PT97 -------------------------------------------------- This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: unsubscribe feministsf Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2002 05:32:15 -0600 Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: "Laura J. Mixon" Subject: Re: what is an ansible? Comments: To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" In-Reply-To: <3C725721.D45034FB@uwm.edu> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit on 2/19/02 7:46 AM, Michael J. Lowrey at orangest@UWM.EDU wrote: > "Laura J. Mixon" wrote: >> >> on 2/18/02 2:10 AM, Lee Anne Phillips at leeanne@LEEANNE.COM wrote: >>> Actually, there are several tantalizing hints that FTL *communication* >>> *may* be possible, although we don't yet understand exactly how it >>> might work, if at all. We should note that Einstein insisted that FTL >>> communication and travel was impossible, but used it, among other >>> things, to "prove" that quantum physics did not exist, a conceit which >>> we would now consider "quaint" at best. While it seems unlikely, >>> given our present state of knowledge, we don't know everything >>> there is to know, and don't even know what sort of questions to ask >>> about many bits of the universe that we may not have noticed or >>> understood in any real sense. >> >> Actually, to be technically correct, Einstein's general theory of relativity >> says that you can't accelerate an object with mass to the speed of light. >> This is where Niven (or was it Clarke?) got his "inertial-less drive" idea >> -- the idea was you instantly jump to that new velocity, without >> accelerating to it... > > It wasn't either of those young whippersnappers; the > inertialess drive is to be found in the works of the > Chronicler of Civilization, E.E. "Doc" Smith, Ph.D.! Don't > they teach anything about classic literature in the schools > these days... [grumble, mutter] > > -- > Michael J. Lowrey > orangelensman@clearether.com Whoops! Brain fart. -------------------------------------------------- This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: unsubscribe feministsf Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2002 19:32:14 EST Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: Joy Martin Subject: Re: what is necessary for Utopia?: Martin and Phillips Comments: To: feministsf@uic.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 2/20/02 1:05:11 AM Central Standard Time, foxbrick@NETZERO.NET writes: << Joy, if you haven't yet read Russ's MAGIC MOMMAS, TREMBLING SISTERS, PURITANS AND PERVERTS, dig and delve! This slim volume of essays is more challenging, perhaps, than even TO WRITE LIKE A WOMAN or WHAT ARE WE FIGHTING FOR?, >> I guess I'm wrong, I don't think I've read any of those, unless they've been issued under different titles. I haven't seen anything new anywhere I shop for books for ages. Who is the publisher?-Joy -------------------------------------------------- This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: unsubscribe feministsf Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2002 18:11:54 -0800 Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: Lee Anne Phillips Subject: Re: what is necessary for Utopia?: Martin and Phillips Comments: To: Feminist SF In-Reply-To: <99.2222c2c4.29a59a0e@cs.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 07:32 PM 2/20/02 -0500, Joy Martin wrote: >I guess I'm wrong, I don't think I've read any of those, unless they've been >issued under different titles. I haven't seen anything new anywhere I shop >for books for ages. Who is the publisher?-Joy Magic Mommas, Trembling Sisters, Puritans & Perverts Crossing Press, 1989 A collection of essays including a charming discussion of Spock/Kirk "Slash" fiction. "Slash" runs the gamut from heavy petting to pornography, but Spock/Kirk Slash tends toward the graphic. I prefer Seven/Torres or Janeway/Torres, all in all... ;-) Fan Fiction is probably a fertile topic of discussion as well. As people have become more enamored of TV, and of TV shows, quite a few bold souls have started making the darned tube do what they want it to, instead of what advertisers insist on. There's a pleasing anarchy in this. How to Suppress Women's Writing University of Texas Press, 1983 It's surprisingly easy. To Write Like a Woman: Essays in Feminism and Science Fiction Indiana University Press, 1995 How to Write Like a Woman I think this may have been another ???, 1995 edition of the above. British? On Strike Against God Out & Out Books, 1980 Crossing Press, 1985 What Are We Fighting For?: Sex, Race, Class, and the Future of Feminism St. Martin's Press, 1998 The Hidden Side of the Moon: Stories St. Martin's Press, c1987 -------------------------------------------------- This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: unsubscribe feministsf Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2002 22:30:49 EST Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: Joy Martin Subject: Re: what is necessary for Utopia?: Martin and Phillips Comments: To: feministsf@uic.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thanks. I have How to Suppress Women's Writing. Maybe also On Strike Against God (gotta check the bookshelves), but don't think I've seen the others. Will check it out.-Joy -------------------------------------------------- This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: unsubscribe feministsf Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 01:39:09 -0800 Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: Todd Mason Subject: Which Russes are necessary for Utopia?: Martin and Phillips Comments: To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit THE OTHER SIDE OF THE MOON is almost a career retrospective, and I prefer it (such early work as the impressive 1966? MAGAZINE OF HORROR story "Come Closer" stands unashamed with the later) to even the more latter-day collections as THE ZANZIBAR CAT and (EXTRA)ORDINARY PEOPLE (both 1984--wow, 18 years now...adults have been born since their publication). I think ON STRIKE AGAINST GOD is an excellent novella to read alongside THE FEMALE MAN; they illuminate each other, as do the autobiographical passages in MAGIC MOMMAS. And if you can find a good file of THE MAGAZINE OF FANTASY AND SCIENCE FICTION from the '70s and into the '80s, not only will you find a number of her stories, but also a dozen or so of her mostly uncollected book review columns, when she was one of F&SF's regular alternate critics (supplementing first James Blish and later Algis Budrys as the most-frequent columnist, other "alternates" included Barry Malzberg, Harlan Ellison, Avram Davidson, John Clute...she was very nearly the only frequently-read woman's voice in this regard between Judith Merril's long 1960s run as primary critic and Elizabeth Hand, Michelle West and a few others settling in over the last decade). And, of course, there have been contributions to feminist magazines and journals, aside from the ones collected in the collections noted below. TM Lee Anne Phillips wrote: > At 07:32 PM 2/20/02 -0500, Joy Martin wrote: > >I guess I'm wrong, I don't think I've read any of those, unless they've been > >issued under different titles. I haven't seen anything new anywhere I shop > >for books for ages. Who is the publisher?-Joy > > Magic Mommas, Trembling Sisters, Puritans & Perverts > Crossing Press, 1989 > > A collection of essays including a charming discussion of > Spock/Kirk "Slash" fiction. "Slash" runs the gamut from > heavy petting to pornography, but Spock/Kirk Slash > tends toward the graphic. I prefer Seven/Torres or > Janeway/Torres, all in all... ;-) Fan Fiction is probably > a fertile topic of discussion as well. As people have > become more enamored of TV, and of TV shows, > quite a few bold souls have started making the darned > tube do what they want it to, instead of what advertisers > insist on. There's a pleasing anarchy in this. > > How to Suppress Women's Writing > University of Texas Press, 1983 > > It's surprisingly easy. > > To Write Like a Woman: Essays in Feminism and Science Fiction > Indiana University Press, 1995 > > How to Write Like a Woman I think this may have been another > ???, 1995 edition of the above. British? > > On Strike Against God > Out & Out Books, 1980 > Crossing Press, 1985 > > What Are We Fighting For?: Sex, Race, Class, and the Future of Feminism > St. Martin's Press, 1998 > > The Hidden Side of the Moon: Stories > St. Martin's Press, c1987 ---------------------------------------------------- Sign Up for NetZero Platinum Today Only $9.95 per month! http://my.netzero.net/s/signup?r=platinum&refcd=PT97 -------------------------------------------------- This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: unsubscribe feministsf Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 01:45:08 -0800 Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: Todd Mason Subject: Russ TOCs Comments: To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Ah, memory plays me false...THE ZANZIBAR CAT is also a retrospective collection. from: http://www.locusmag.com/index/t8.html#A1054 and html#11266 The Hidden Side of the Moon Joanna Russ (St. Martin^Òs 0-312-01105-9, Jan ^Ò88, $15.95, 229pp, hc); Collection of 26 stories. Highly recommended. (FCM) 1 ^Õ The Little Dirty Girl ^Õ nv Elsewhere v2, ed. Terri Winding & Mark Alan Arnold, Ace, 1982 23 ^Õ Sword Blades and Poppy Seed ^Õ ss Heroic Visions, ed. Jessica Amanda Salmonson, Ace, 1983 29 ^Õ Main Street: 1953 ^Õ ss Sinister Wisdom #24 ^Ò83 33 ^Õ How Dorothy Kept Away the Spring ^Õ ss F&SF Feb ^Ò77 42 ^Õ This Afternoon ^Õ ss Cimarron Review Feb ^Ò68 49 ^Õ This Night, at My Fire ^Õ ss Epoch Win ^Ò66 53 ^Õ ^ÓI Had Vacantly Crumpled It into My Pocket...But By God, Eliot, It Was a Photograph from Life!^Ô ^Õ ss F&SF Aug ^Ò64 64 ^Õ Come Closer ^Õ ss Magazine of Horror Aug ^Ò65 70 ^Õ It^Òs Important to Believe ^Õ vi Sinister Wisdom #14 ^Ò80 71 ^Õ Mr. Wilde^Òs Second Chance ^Õ vi F&SF Sep ^Ò66 74 ^Õ Window Dressing ^Õ ss New Worlds of Fantasy #2, ed. Terry Carr, Ace, 1970 81 ^Õ Existence ^Õ ss Epoch, ed. Roger Elwood & Robert Silverberg, Berkley, 1975 91 ^Õ Foul Fowl ^Õ ss The Little Magazine Spr ^Ò71 95 ^Õ A Short and Happy Life ^Õ vi F&SF Jun ^Ò69 98 ^Õ The Throwaways ^Õ ss Consumption Sum ^Ò69 103 ^Õ The Cliches from Outer Space [revised from The Witch and the Chamelion, April 1 ^Ò75] ^Õ ss Women^Òs Studies International Forum v7 #2 ^Ò84 112 ^Õ Elf Hill ^Õ ss F&SF Nov ^Ò82 124 ^Õ Nor Custom Stale ^Õ ss F&SF Sep ^Ò59 138 ^Õ The Experimenter ^Õ nv Galaxy Oct ^Ò75 156 ^Õ Reasonable People ^Õ ss Orbit 14, ed. Damon Knight, Harper & Row, 1974 162 ^Õ Life in a Furniture Store ^Õ ss Epoch Fll ^Ò65 175 ^Õ The View from This Window ^Õ nv Quark #1, ed. Samuel R. Delany & Marilyn Hacker, Paperback Library, 1970 195 ^Õ Old Pictures ^Õ vi The Little Magazine Win ^Ò73 197 ^Õ Visiting ^Õ vi The Manhattan Review Fll ^Ò67 200 ^Õ Visiting Day ^Õ ss South v2 #1 ^Ò70 206 ^Õ Old Thoughts, Old Presences ^Õ gp; The Autobiography of My Mother, ss Epoch Fll ^Ò75; Daddy^Òs Girl, ss Epoch Spr ^Ò75 Extra(ordinary) People Joanna Russ (St. Martin^Òs 0-312-27806-3, Apr ^Ò84 [Mar ^Ò84], $10.95, 161pp, hc); Collection of 5 stories, including the Hugo-winning novella ^ÓSouls^Ô. Recommended. (FCM) ^Õ Souls ^Õ na F&SF Jan ^Ò82 ^Õ The Mystery of the Young Gentleman ^Õ nv Speculations, ed. Isaac Asimov & Alice Laurance, Houghton Mifflin, 1982 ^Õ Bodies ^Õ nv ^Õ What Did You Do During the Revolution, Grandma? ^Õ nv The Seattle Review Spr ^Ò83 ^Õ Everyday Depressions ^Õ ss The Zanzibar Cat Joanna Russ (Baen 0-671-55906-0, Sep ^Ò84 [Aug ^Ò84], $3.50, 286pp, pb); Collection, contents revised from Arkham House 1983 edition. 9 ^Õ When It Changed ^Õ ss Again, Dangerous Visions, ed. Harlan Ellison, Garden City, NY: Doubleday, 1972 22 ^Õ The Extraordinary Voyages of Amélie Bertrand ^Õ ss F&SF Sep ^Ò79 42 ^Õ The Soul of a Servant ^Õ ss Showcase, ed. Roger Elwood, Harper & Row, 1973 65 ^Õ The Man Who Could Not See Devils ^Õ ss Alchemy & Academe, ed. Anne McCaffrey, Garden City, NY: Doubleday, 1970 84 ^Õ Gleepsite ^Õ ss Orbit 9, ed. Damon Knight, G.P. Putnam^Òs, 1971 93 ^Õ Nobody^Òs Home ^Õ ss New Dimensions II, ed. Robert Silverberg, Doubleday, 1972 116 ^Õ My Dear Emily ^Õ nv F&SF Jul ^Ò62 147 ^Õ There Is Another Shore, You Know, Upon the Other Side ^Õ ss F&SF Sep ^Ò63 166 ^Õ My Boat ^Õ ss F&SF Jan ^Ò76 192 ^Õ Useful Phrases for the Tourist ^Õ ss Universe 2, ed. Terry Carr, Ace, 1972 198 ^Õ Dragons and Dimwits ^Õ vi F&SF Dec ^Ò79 205 ^Õ Corruption ^Õ ss Aurora: Beyond Equality, ed. Vonda McIntyre & Susan Anderson, Fawcett, 1976 222 ^Õ The Precious Object ^Õ nv Red Clay Reader #7 ^Ò70 244 ^Õ The New Men ^Õ ss F&SF Feb ^Ò66 256 ^Õ A Game of Vlet ^Õ ss F&SF Feb ^Ò74 274 ^Õ The Zanzibar Cat ^Õ ss Quark #3, ed. Samuel R. Delany & Marilyn Hacker, Paperback Library, 1971 ---------------------------------------------------- Sign Up for NetZero Platinum Today Only $9.95 per month! http://my.netzero.net/s/signup?r=platinum&refcd=PT97 -------------------------------------------------- This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: unsubscribe feministsf Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 20:12:19 EST Reply-To: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" Sender: "For discussion of feminist SF, fantastic & utopian literature" From: Joy Martin Subject: Re: Russ TOCs Comments: To: feministsf@uic.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Turns out I do have The Hidden Side of the Moon, as well as Extraordinary People and the Zanzibar Cat (somewhere). Now I have the urge to reread. lately I've actually been do a little rereading. Otherwise I have a terrible or not so terrible habit of constantly reading new things as fast as possible, and never getting back to the good ones a second time. Thanks :>)-Joy -------------------------------------------------- This is the feministsf listserve, intended only for discussion of feminism and Speculative Fiction. To unsubscribe from this listserve, send a message to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.UIC.EDU and in the body of the message say: unsubscribe feministsf Contact feministsf-request@UIC.EDU if there are problems.